>> today we mourn for more americans that represent the best of the united states of america. we will not waiver in our commitment to see that justice is done for this terrible act and make no mistake, justice will be done. >> this is on the heels of romney's slamming the president's response which became a fierce back and forth between the two campaigns. and mitt romney appeared in florida, launching a preemptive attack on the obama administration. >> the first response of the united states must be outrage of the breach of the sovereignty of our nation. an apology for american values is never the right course. as i watched over the passed 3 1/2 years, the president has had some successes and failures, and it's a hit or miss approach, but not based upon sound foreign policy. >> here is the statement

released just before midnight that kicked off the campaign bickering. romney saying it's disgraceful that obama's administration's first response was not to condemn the attack but to sympathize with those that waged attacks. >> hillary clinton expressing our profound sadness over the deaths of the americans, including ambassador stevens. >> today many americans are asking, indeed, i asked myself, how could this happen? how could this happen in a country we helped liberate in a city we helped save from destruction? the protests sparked by

outrage over a film made by an israeli filmmaker in california, and the film sparking outrage in neighboring egypt. we covered this with nbc news white house correspondent, and chuck i want to start with you and talk about the developments this morning. we have overnight back and forth between the campaigns and the white house. you have mitt romney blasting the president overnight saying they were standing by the comments from what he had to say in florida. competing appearances from the president and from mitt romney and all of a sudden the foreign policy issue has exploded in a big way on this campaign. i know the first read came out this morning with the thoughts just before 10:00 a.m. describing what had happened overnight, calling it over the

top, and saying after learning new information about the attacks, the romney statement looks worst ae and worse and of key. >> this is part of an argument he has been want to go make for a while on the president in foreign policy. remember his whole memoir is called no apologize. and romney is perceived of having no foreign policies himself. this is part of a larger debate that he has wanted to have. the question, of course, is timing. did he do himself any good by doing it when he did before the facts were known, and before we knew that an ambassador had been killed and that romney was responding to a statement from a u.s. embassy who at the time was trying to quell protesters and it's a statement that the white

house later backtracked from, as romney noted there, but clearly he decided politically, and he may have been right, it would have been worse for him to back down from the statement that he did overnight, that he had no choice but to, quote, unquote, double down with his criticism. and it sparks the debate on the management of the arab spring, which is the conversation to have about the relationship between the united states and egypt, and how much of an ally is egypt? he is drawing lines in the sand earlier than you would expect at a time like this when a challenger realizes he can't compete with the rose garden. >> take a look. >> i spoke out when the key fact that i referred to was known, which was that the embassy of

the united states issued what appeared to be an apology for american principles. that was a mistake. i believe when a mistake is made of that significance, you speak out. >> chuck, is this going to help mitt romney get swing votes, foreign policy, or does that weigh into the fact that obama got such a bounce in the convention -- >> i think it's a riskier time to pick, and the timing is risky, and do you wait for foreign policy debate? that's the path they have chosen. i know behind the scenes there's some romney surrogates that are second guessing whether the timing of this was the right timing and appropriate given the events that were still unfolding at the time. i think there is more risk here than potential reward. yes, he created a debate now, and he is part of this story,

and this is sort of the classic chasing the news cycle politics of campaigning, and when you are this close to the election, you should probably expect no less. >> the flags on the hill of congress and on the hill are being lowered to half staff, and what we know, the facts coming in of what we know, and during hillary clinton's statement, she named sean smith and chris stevens, saying the two other people murdered in the attacks are unnamed until proper kin is notified, and smith being an air force vet and also information officer in the diplomatic service, last hour with chris

jansing, and romney was trying to politicize this. the president did not address romney one bit on the campaign trail from the rose garden. >> nor, did he mention the situation this egypt, which will be part of the debate. he did not address that the egyptian government has yet to condemn what happened at the u.s. embassy in cairo, and they wanted to deal with the deaths of the diplomats, and that's why he is headed over to the state department as a morale and comforting moment for him than anything else, but there's still a larger question to be answered in regards to how the egyptian government has responded to this. >> i want to bring you into the conversation, mick, and we were talking about ambassador stevens' approach to helping save libya, a country that he

wanted to see free from the dictatorship of moammar gadhafi and killed in a city, benghazi, that he helped to save. i understand that there are 200 marines being sent to libya. what do we know about the tk orders? >> 200 marines who are already in the region, they are aboard one of those flat-top helicopter carriers in the iranian sea. they are called amphibious ready groups, and they are called f.a.s.t. teams prepositioned in all parts of the world, but particularly the hot middle east region as we see here. it should not take long to get those 200 marines who will be particularly equipped for the mission there in tripoli. this is not some kind of military operation or a strike

of any kind. they will be armed with small arms and anti-riot gear and the like as opposed to going in for a military strike or operation. now in addition to that preparations are under way, too, to send additional f.a.s.t. teams, maybe not in the same numbers, but one to cairo and one to kabul. we know from past experience there has been violent and deadly sectarian flare ups against americans in kabul over some of the actions of american troops there that were perceived to slight islam and mohammed. these marines are poised and ready to go and they should not take long at all to get to tripoli. in addition, the air force fired up cargo planes, we believe

c-17s that will head to the region, and some to serve possibly as medevacs if needed to take out injured or wounded americans, and if the orders are given and we think they may be to evacuate any nonessential u.s. personnel from the embassy and consulate there in libya for perhaps further violence. >> are we learning anything about intelligence or intelligent sources that would have given any indication of the violence that happened so quickly to kill the american foreign service workers? >> it did happen fast. this film that really portrayed a missouri as a fake really didn't make much of a flash when it was first released in hollywood. but as soon as it got up on youtube, it shot around the world in a flash and sparked

these riots. in some sense, i think the u.s. was caught flat-footed. what was interested in the 9/11 remarks yesterday here at the pentagon in his first paragraph, president obama talked about the fact that the war on terrorism is not a war against islam, against the muslim religion, and i thought at the time it was a little odd to have that in the first paragraph. i asked today if the white house was aware that this could potentially happen, and i was told, no, that was not the case but that was the choice of the white house and the president to emphasize that. >> let me ask you to stand by for a second. we have richard engel on the phone from cairo. richard, describe the scene as you are seeing there as it is the ripple affect. >> reporter: it's a fairly small demonstration, and very agitated but by and large peaceful.

they tried to lighten successfully to flight an american flag on fire. there are hundreds of egyptian security forces watching passively as they are standing in front of the main entrance to the u.s. embassy. there have been no crashes or attempts to climb the wall. this could be a preview of what could come on friday when the protests are larger by the muslim brotherhood which is the organization of egypt's new president, morsi. >> this anger is based on the film that was made that the u.s. government has come out to chastise, correct? >> reporter: this is all based on that film, but it's more than that. it's a perceived insult, it's a

perceived attack on islam, and a perceived attack on the cornerstone of islam, which is the personality and teachings of the profit mohammed. it doesn't matter about the video for the people here, it touched a sensitive issue and they feel they could not take it lying down and they had to come out and speak for their profit and religion. there are other people that think that this is only drawing more attention to an offensive video, and there are other egyptians that do not agree with what is going on here. >> richard in cairo where the anger is growing. paul ryan is expected to comment in wisconsin, and that begins in roughly an hour. we will have much more after the

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the administration was wrong to stand by a statement sympathizing with those that breached our embassy instead of undeming their actions. it's never too early for the united states to condemn acts of violence on americans. >> that was mitt romney condemning the president's response to the tragedy. according to the white house president obama was notified of the death of ambassador stevens earlier this morning. stevens who in his statement biography said he considered

himself fortunate to participate in the change and hope in libya. and the death comes two weeks before the president is scheduled to give a speech at the united nations. we have joe ruben a former state department officer who served during the invasion in iraq, and a former white house middle east adviser, and a mideast editor for "newsweek." joel, i want to start with you. i know you knew ambassador stevens personally. this morning, secretary clinton offered words in reflection of the ambassador's work. take a listen. >> he risked his life to stop a tyrant, and then gave his life trying to help build a better libya. the world needs more chris steve

stevenses. >> now the city that he was murdered, what are you going to remember most? >> he was a wonderful person. i had the honor of working with him in the senate. he was on a fellowship working for senator lugar, a republicen. he was kind and he was a star in foreign service and a former peace corps volunteer, and he gave of himself and served our country. he been the out and promoted america's view of the world and our vision and values and interacted directly in the heat of the battle with people who need to know about the good side of america, and he was the best of america. >> sensitivity for all the people that we lost, and the other person that we know who has been named is sean smith, who was an air force veteran. two other people were also lost

in that raid in libya, and they have not been identified as of yet until the next of kin can be notified. i want to talk to you, because this has to hit you in the gut because of your work as a foreign service worker. the last time an american ambassador was killed was in 1979. explain to all of us what this means in the diplomacy world, the type of loss that this means for the state department and family and reminder that the peril that many workers are in? >> thomas, one of the most important memories i can bring here, the muslim world work, we commend him for all the work he has done in libya, but there are

thousands of other foreign work officers are unarmed and they are not secured by the u.s. marines but by the local security and the diplomatic agencies, and time and again, whether it's me or my colleagues, we are subjected or have been subjected to threats, intimidation, attacks on u.s. personnel. he is a hero. the people part of our diplomatic core are heros in the middle east. it's the most important experiment we can face during the arab awakenings to help this transition come about. he was prepared to roll up his sleeves and do what so many other foreign officers are doing in the middle east right now. >> the president coming off a

successful convention where the democrats are more like the dad tkae party when it comes to their military observations and foreign policy strengths. now we have all of this going on with the president right now with syria, the murders in libya, israel, and netanyahu trying to put pressure on president obama for the iran nuclear program. this foreign policy umbrella is front and center for the president? >> i think to keep in mind and what is disturbing, it's all about local politics. we can talk about it as foreign policy, but in libya there's a democracy taking shape and the people that killed the u.s. ambassador want to destroy that democracy. the same thing is happening in egypt. now we have the muslim brotherhood calling a rally because it has to one-up those

that occupied the embassy, and here in the united states, we are not conducting foreign policy at this point, we are conducting an election campaign and we have statements by mitt romney before the commander in chief has had a chance to speak. all of that is hugely complicating, as you described already as a hugely complicated situation. >> was that a desperate move by romney trying to serve his own role diplomatically. >> i don't think it was very smart where you have a commander in chief and a politician that has no responsibility at all. it's understandable but reprehensible. >> the president is meeting with the state department, and at

this difficult time the president will give service for the sacrifices and pay tribute to those that were lost is what the note says. thank you for you joining me today, and thank you for your insights and observations. next up, we look at the man causing all the outrage in libya. connected to the florida pastor, terry jones. you might have heard his name before. he burned korans last year that incited violence in afghanistan. because the results... are you having fun doing this? yeah. that's a very nice cake! [ male announcer ] well, you can't beat them. [ giggles ] ohh! you got something huh? whoa... [ male announcer ] humana understands

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his service in the middle east throughout his career was legendary. my thoughts and prayers are with the loved ones of all the fallen. they will be missed and never forgotten. we are still waiting on confirmation of two of the four being killed, and we know one is ambassador stevens, and the other is sean smith and two other people that have not been identified as of yet. the california man who made this film about the profit mohammed that sparked the protest has gone into hiding. that man to the left promoting the movie is florida pastor, terry jones, and he had a history of provocative acts against islam. explain the connection of pastor jones to this, and why he is involved with this film? >> he is the 59-year-old pastor

in rural florida of gainesville, a small church, and if they have 50 members that would be a lot. he has found a way to make his voice known around the world through the internet before and that's possible what happened here again today. we are attempting to speak to him directly. there's a crew with him setting up to do an interview, but so far we have not actually spoken to pastor terry jones. yesterday he had on 9/11, what he called international judge mohammed day, and on this day he not only held with a small group of his parishioners, but had a live stream on the internet where he showed about a 13-minute promotional clip of this movie. now, because in the past he has been able to get international attention, it's possible that his broadcast or his stream on the internet captured the attention in the islamic world. he stated on his website that

the fact that angry protesters climbed the wall at the u.s. embassy in cairo, ripped down the american flag and tore it apart further indicates the lack of respect that islam has for any other religion. he says the movie is to show the destructive ideology of islam. that's going back to what he has effectively done before. if we go back to 2010, he wanted to burn the koran. there was so much outrage built-up internationally because of his claim, it took a phone call from barack obama to stop it. but then in 2011, he did actually burn those korans, and he posted that video on the internet and in kandahar, afghanistan, there was such a violent reaction, nine people killed and 81 injured. so he is this small voice of a very small church in a very tucked away part of florida who has found a way to get a mega

phone through the internet and capture -- and in this case, perhaps encourage, the outrage of a movie that really was obscure. >> when we talk about the obscurity of the movie, i have seen part of clips from the film, and it looks so low budget, nothing that can be believed to be a highly produced blockbuster that may have been miss construed to people within egypt and libya, to think it was a propaganda film to hit movie theaters on september 11th, but did you say there was a crew with him now? >> yeah, they are setting up with him right now. he agreed to do an interview. we have an nbc producer also there and is going to ask questions as well. we are not going to show that live, even if we have the satellite capabilities, because i would like to hear what he has to say.

remember what he said so far has been so inflammatory in the past, it's better to listen to it a little bit and understand and put into some context what he is saying. quite frankly, it's a little hard to determine how much influence he had in this or not. we do know in the past he has had a voice because of the ability to have a mega phone affect on the internet. >> when we talk about the filmmaker, the original filmmaker, do we know how they got hooked up? >> we don't know what the relationship is between the two of them. we hope to know. it may be simply shared ideology. >> kerry sanders, we appreciate it. we will take and break here on msnbc and we're back after this. with the spark cash card from capital one,

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administration to increase our security at diplomatic posts around the world. >> president obama talking in just the passed hour on the attack in benghazi, libya, that killed four americans, that killed diplomat, stevens and sean smith. joining me now is a member of the house armed services committee in california. congressman, it's nice to have you with me to talk about this. president obama vowing that those responsible are going to be brought to justice and we are hearing as many as 200 marines sent to tripoli to bolster security happening. what do we know more about the obama administration's response to this, because as we know mitt romney who has come out to attack his response, they could say america took their eye off

the ball, and now the film is now responsible for the four american deaths? >> we still have to do some of the investigation, thomas. i will tell you that we have not taken our eye off the ball. we have continued to be concerned about who really has power in libya, and what type of a government we can assume will really play out there and how things settled down, and we have the same issues going on in egypt, as you know. i don't think it's a matter of having taken our eye off the ball, but it's the obscure things that happen out in the cyber world sometimes can have an impact. i will tell you this. every diplomat that we have overseas, and i visit quite a few of them as you know because not only am i on the armed forces committee but i am number two on the homeland security

committee. the jobs can be dangerous and they know that every day as they move forward. and we are very saddened, and it has been a long time since we have seen something like this, especially our ambassador and three other staff. so we are very saddened by that. certainly i would not take on president obama. he has been strong. he has been more determined. he has had more guts to go in when we have had to and, you know, witness that osama bin laden issue, where many at the table said let's not do that, and he was steadfast and cool and he said we're going to do it and get it right. these people that did the attack, beware, because this president is very strong. >> we are just getting word that the libyan ambassador to the u.s. will be joining a noon

press conference today with leading american muslims and other faith leaders to condemn the murder of ambassador stevens and others. and paul ryan will be discussing this at his town hall meeting, and there's a live picture there, that rally in wisconsin. yeah, somebody warming up the crowd. my eyesight is not what it used to be, congresswoman, so forgive me. and what is your response of romney criticizing the white house's response? >> i think as we go overseas and conduct foreign policy, we are one. you know, mitt romney just doesn't have the experience in this arena. i mean, this is -- it's really

sad, but it's -- it's sort of like a t-ball move. he doesn't understand how important it is for americans to be united on this front. i feel sad that he would come out and attack the president when we have been working very hard as a team to insure that the arab spring comes to a place where we have stable countries and where we have countries and governments that we can work with, because that's certainly the people of libya and the people of egypt and other places of this type are supportive of americans, and they do like americans, and we need to insure that we can work with other governments and help those people have a better future, because when they have a better future we have a better future. >> while you are saying that we are seeing the images of egyptians in cairo tearing down the flag and ripping it into pieces, and one person was holding up one of the american

stars from the flag smiling as if they are tearing it to shreds. how are americans supposed to hear what you are saying and believe that our support, our tax dollars, our money is being spent wisely. >> it's like everything else. there are those that go out on the streets and use any excuse to make mayhem happen. in my younger years i lived in cairo, egypt. it was after the camp david accord. and there was a strong desire by these people to keep pushing forward and to have a democracy. they feel many of them very indebted to the americans, and not just for camp david, and what put them on a more prosperous future, but they are very hopeful that once things settle out from this arab spring that in fact their children will have a future, and that's what

they care about. they are no different than we are when we look at the future, when they look at the future of america and say we want our children to have a better world to live in. i know many egyptians personally, and i know that's the way they feel. >> congresswoman loretta sanchez. we'll be right back after this. stay tuned. multi-policy discount. paperless discount. paid-in-full discount. [yawning] homeowner's discount. safe driver discount. chipmunk family reunion. someone stole the nuts. squirrel jail. justice!

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scarred by war and tyranny, they were hailed as friends and partners. and when the attack came yesterday, libyans stood and fought to defend our post. >> libyans helped some of our diplomats find safety and they carried stevens' body to the hospital where we tragically learned he had died. >> and president obama and hillary clinton praising the libyan people who came to the aid of the ambassadors. when will egypt and libyan governments issue a strong condemnation from those acts. now we are getting word that four people have been arrested for breaking into the embassy in cairo, and we will hear about

that. joining me now, the washington, d.c. bureau chief for al jazeera. let's talk about the deputy ambassador and several libyan security officers were killed in the u.s. consulate siege. the president and the secretary of state praised their work in trying to give the people of libya their freedom. i know ambassador stevens worked hard at saving the city of benghazi, specifically, the city that he has been killed in. explain to americans that are watching this relationship between what are the entirety of the libyan people towards the u.s. to spike this violence? >> there's very broad contact in which this has happened. there is obviously one historical context, and part of the context is that remember the

first war that the united states had was against libya, and it was dealing with pirates off the coast of libya. the relationship between the united states and libya has been complex and complicated. on the one hand there are libyans that feel that the united states had tried under the former president, george bush, tried to bring gadhafi back into the fold of the international community following the lockerbie bombings, so there's resentment on that front, and there are a lot of libyans aware, although there is some suspicious surrounding the intervention of the united states and nato toppling libya, and there are a lot of libyans aware that the united states did play a major role in getting rid of the person that they called the brutal dictator that ruled them

for years. it's a complex issue. i should add one more thing. this event, we are hearing reports and attributing it to libya, and it's a broad spectrum. we don't know the details of that yet. we know as small as they are, some strands of the sal sraez are capable of implicating large parts of public opinion. and we have been hearing reports over the last few weeks that remanence of the gadhafi regime are still in existence, and they are trying to undermined the situation in libya, and the chief was recently handed over to the libyans, and there is a cocktail of so many factors. the bottom line is the situation, the security situation in libya is still very complex, and it still prevents a challenge not just to the united

states, but to the neighbors of libya and to the neighbors. >> we know there have been marines sent to help stabilize the situation as weyou, ab deerl jazeera. pass along we are expecting the live remarks from congressman paul ryan in his home state of wisconsin. he's expected to speak and address the killing of americans in libya. we'll be right back after this. . just picking up some, brochures, posters copies of my acceptance speech. great! it's always good to have a backup plan, in case i get hit by a meteor. wow, your hair looks great. didn't realize they did photoshop here. hey, good call on those mugs. can't let 'em see what you're drinking. you know, i'm glad we're both running a nice, clean race. no need to get nasty. here's your "honk if you had an affair with taylor" yard sign. looks good. [ male announcer ] fedex office. now save 50% on banners. [ male announcer ] fedex office.

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welcome back we'll bring back in joel ruben, former state department officers that served during the invasion of iraq and knew ambassador stevens very well and mark beginsburg, former ambassador to morocco. i know you've been waiting around patiently after everything you've heard and especially given the fact that secretary of state hillary clinton said there is no valid

reason for the type of violence we have seen,s specially given the reasoning that we have now been informed about the obscure film that started the type of murderous riot that took the lives of these four americans, what should it tell us back here at home about the instability that exists in libya and the fact that they can be inspired in such a fashion to cause a murderous riot by such an obscure film? >> it tells us that the situation is volatile and reminds us of how re need to follow kris's example of religious tolerance of promoting freedom. chris exemplified the mindset of building bridges and fixing problems. we need to make sure we're clear headed on where the attack came from and not to demagog as well an entire society. chris would not like that and it's important that we follow his example. >> mark, such a tragedy, but diplomatically going forward, how does america work with libya

moving forward and also now in what we're seeing, the violence, protests taking place, in egypt and the attention we need to focus there. >> the government in libya is still very fragile and we have to keep working with it because in the end it's going to survive and democratize based on institution building. i want to reserve something to say about egypt. mr. morsi, the president of egypt, has an obligation not only to the united states but also to his own people. he cannot have it both ways. he cannot expect the american taxpayer to bail him out by giving him billions of dollars, while his government stands on the sidelines while demonstrators attack the u.s. embassy. either he speaks out against this type of violence, or he should be held accountable by the american people for not doing enough to stop this. >> not only attacking the u.s. embassy, but obviously ripping up the american flag there and replacing it with islamic banners and doing so for the american taxpayer to see. it's quite a contradiction in

terms of what we need to do going forward. mark, thank you so much, joel ruben, thank you. i appreciate you guys patiently waiting around with me. that's going to wrap up things for me. see you back here tomorrow at 11:00 eastern joined by colorado senator mark udall, melissa harris perry and our power panel. always follow me on twitter. don't go anywhere. "now" with alex wagner comes your way next. >> time for the your business entre were you near of the week. joshua davis knows the frustration of looking for funding. after being turned down by multiple lenders, the owner of the gelato fiasco in maine contacted a community group making loans to small business owners. he got the money he needed and now he's back to focusing on flavors. for more watch "your business" sunday morning on msnbc. to do i! now we need a little bit more...

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